[quote=Tdarcos post_id=141458 time=1706225380 user_id=829]
Also, couldn't the other team raise a pass interference foul claim? Could it be that the refs also depend on each team being a passionate advocate for their own side?
[/quote]

You cannot challenge a penalty in the NFL.

[quote="Ice Cream Jonsey" post_id=141447 time=1706208671 user_id=3]
[quote="Da King" post_id=141433 time=1706107141 user_id=4]
[quote=Jizaboz post_id=141431 time=1706065315 user_id=910]
That was definitely pass interference unless they happened to be playing with NFL BLITZ rules that day.
[/quote]

Or Mutant League Football. That was the best football game ever.
[/quote]

Yes!! With all the retro devices going around now, I have to try that again and re-remember it.
[/quote]

Also available, Mutant League Hockey.

When you secure these games, please make sure they come to Rochester with you.

For your own information, do I think it was pass interference? Yes. My quoting the rules was to show why it is possible a referee didn't call it that way. Again, the referees don't have the luxury of seeing the game from 30 feet above the playing field. They might not have been looking there.

Also, couldn't the other team raise a pass interference foul claim? Could it be that the refs also depend on each team being a passionate advocate for their own side?

[quote="Da King" post_id=141433 time=1706107141 user_id=4]
[quote=Jizaboz post_id=141431 time=1706065315 user_id=910]
That was definitely pass interference unless they happened to be playing with NFL BLITZ rules that day.
[/quote]

Or Mutant League Football. That was the best football game ever.
[/quote]

Yes!! With all the retro devices going around now, I have to try that again and re-remember it.

[quote="Da King" post_id=141433 time=1706107141 user_id=4]
[quote=Jizaboz post_id=141431 time=1706065315 user_id=910]
That was definitely pass interference unless they happened to be playing with NFL BLITZ rules that day.
[/quote]

Or Mutant League Football. That was the best football game ever.
[/quote]

Hell yeah! That was a good one.

I used to piss people off in Blitz by spamming the pass and tackle buttons when on defense. So basically the other dude would hike the ball and by the time he was ready to throw I'd already pulverized most of his receivers lol

[quote=Jizaboz post_id=141431 time=1706065315 user_id=910]
That was definitely pass interference unless they happened to be playing with NFL BLITZ rules that day.
[/quote]

Or Mutant League Football. That was the best football game ever.

That was definitely pass interference unless they happened to be playing with NFL BLITZ rules that day.

[quote=AArdvark post_id=141412 time=1705920713 user_id=20]
The phrase 'football lawyer' keeps bouncing around in my head
[/quote]
What do you think referees are? They're supposed to be familiar with all the rules, sufficient to analyze the action and see if it complies with the rules. If not, they're supposed to stop the game and then impose penalties as appropriate. Actually, they're more like "football police."

I'll try to find the rule. This is good. If this was LEGAL the whole time and Paul found it, I can heal.

The phrase 'football lawyer' keeps bouncing around in my head

Oh dear

[quote="Ice Cream Jonsey" post_id=141373 time=1705803912 user_id=3]I was the biggest football fan. [/quote]
Generally, I have not watched football at all. Occasionally, like in the Tweet you shared, I've seen a few seconds now and then. My mother was a huge fan of the Chicago Bears, but I really never had any interest in football at all. Until now.
[quote="Ice Cream Jonsey" post_id=141373 time=1705803912 user_id=3]In football, you can't - as a defender - blow up the receiver when the ball is on the way, like it is in that play. [/quote]
That's not quite correct, as I will explain below.
[quote="Ice Cream Jonsey" post_id=141373 time=1705803912 user_id=3]
Well, traditionally. Very clearly, we have video evidence in the tweet above that you can! What was [i]supposed[/i] to have happened right there is that the defensive pass interference would have been called on the Rams defender. [/quote]
Well, that's not exactly what the rules say, as I read them. Your complaint moved me, so I decided to do some research. I went to the NFL's website, and as I suspected, they have their rules available for download for free, by anybody who wants to. I'd post them here, but even as a zip file, it's 2 Meg in size; it's too big. The 85 page document as a PDF is 2.3 meg, and can be downloaded from the NFL website at https://operations.nfl.com/media/tvglh0mx/2023-rulebook_final.pdf.

The applicable rule is
" RULE 8 - FORWARD PASS, BACKWARD PASS, FUMBLE" on page 29:[quote="National Football League"]ARTICLE 1. DEFINITION. It is a forward pass if:
(a) the ball initially moves forward (to a point nearer the opponent’s goal line) after leaving the passer’s hand(s);
(b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s); or
(c) a ball is intentionally fumbled and goes forward[/quote]
Okay, this clearly was a forward pass. But, was the hit to the receiver "pass interference?"
[quote="National Football League"]SECTION 5 - PASS INTERFERENCE
ARTICLE 1. DEFINITION. It is pass interference by either team when any act by a player more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage significantly hinders an eligible player’s opportunity to catch the ball. Pass interference can only occur when a forward pass is thrown from behind the line of scrimmage, regardless of whether the pass is legal or illegal, or whether it crosses the line. When the ball is in the air, eligible offensive and defensive receivers have the same right to the path of the ball and are subject to the same restrictions[/quote]
Looks like it was pass interference, however:
[quote="National Football League"]ARTICLE 3. COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) in the field of play, at the sideline, or in the end zone if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
(c) after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, performs any act common to the game (e.g., tuck the ball away, extend it forward, take an additional step, turn upfield, or avoid or ward off an opponent), or he maintains control of the ball long enough to do so.
Notes:
(1) Movement of the ball does not automatically result in loss of control.
(2) If a player, who satisfied (a) and (b), but has not satisfied (c), contacts the ground and loses control of the ball, it is an incomplete pass if the ball hits the ground before he regains control, or if he regains control out of bounds.
(3) A receiver is considered a player in a defenseless posture (See Rule 12, Section 2, Article 9) throughout the entire process of the catch and until the player is capable of avoiding or warding off the impending contact of an opponent.[/quote]
Now, it looks like this was pass interference, i.e. was he protected from being struck, that is, a "defenseless player?" Let's see what the rules say:
[quote="National Football League"]RULE 12 - PLAYER CONDUCT
SECTION 2 - PERSONAL FOULS
ARTICLE 9. PLAYERS IN A DEFENSELESS POSTURE. It is a foul if a player initiates unnecessary contact against a player who is in a defenseless posture. A player who initiates contact against a defenseless opponent is responsible for avoiding an illegal act. A standard of strict liability applies for any contact against an opponent, even if his body position is in motion, and irrespective of any acts by him, such as ducking his head or curling up his body in anticipation of contact.
(a) Players in a defenseless posture are:
(1) A player in the act of or just after throwing a pass (passing posture).
(2) A receiver running a pass route when the defender approaches from the side or behind. If the receiver becomes a blocker or assumes a blocking posture, he is no longer a defenseless player.
(3) A player attempting to catch a pass who has not had time to clearly become a runner. If the player is capable of avoiding or warding off the impending contact of an opponent, he is no longer a defenseless player.[/quote]
If I understand this, if the guy could have seen the approaching player and avoided him, then he's not a defenseless player. It might be arguable he could see the guy approaching him, and could have avoided him, thus he is not a "defenseless player" and can be tacked. If this is what the referees thought, then the tackle would appear to be legal.

With a rule book 85 pages long, conflicting rules can be misinterpreted. In short, it might be a judgment call. If my interpretation of the rules is correct, then the ref was right. Now, if you read the rules and get a different interpretation, please explain why I'm wrong. I don't know football, I'm just going by what I see the rules allow.

I was the biggest football fan. 5 years ago, I mean. My team, the Saints, picked when I was too young to know anything, was playing in the NFC Championship game against the LA Rams. Game was tied, time was running out. We had one of the five best players in NFL history as our quarterback and this would end up being his last truly dominant season - he was the best player in the NFC that year (second in MVP voting overall).

This happened.

https://twitter.com/ActionNetworkHQ/status/1748749416394035347

In football, you can't - as a defender - blow up the receiver when the ball is on the way like it is in that play. Well, traditionally. Very clearly we have video evidence in the tweet above that you can! What was [i]supposed[/i] to have happened right there is that the defensive pass interference would have been called on the Rams defender. The Saints would have gotten a fresh set of downs, and with the Rams just having a timeout, the Saints could have run the clock down to a few seconds before zero, kicked a field goal and gone to the Super Bowl.

That didn't happen and the Rams ended up winning the game. And since then it's been different, me and football. Look, my favorite football team won a Super Bowl earlier in my lifetime. It was great. It is still, to me, the most unbelievable thing that ever happened in sports. Not everyone gets that! But we had SO MANY subsequent playoff games end up as poster material for other teams. I was watching for all of them. I cannot adequately describe how quickly it went from, "I can't believe this happened, this is amazing, we won a SB" to "here's another humiliating playoff loss and I guess I DO care, argh."

So something changed after that non-call five years ago. I think I've watched one non-Saints game since then, the Chiefs - Bills playoff game from a couple of years ago. Drew Brees retired a couple years after the non-call. Then, the year after that our coach left. I checked into the games in 2022 a little... this year, well, I watch my nephew on Sundays. He's more important to me than ... than whatever the the NFL is now.

As a kid I used to wonder why my dad went from someone who obviously cared about baseball and knew everything about it to someone who just didn't care. Well, at some point I realized, they moved his team. He followed the New York Giants. They moved to San Francisco. His favorite player was Willie Mays and they moved the team and they moved him. Some people say that Willie Mays was the greatest baseball player to ever exist and they moved the team he was on! To someone where my father was in life, moving a baseball team to San Francisco might as well have been moving the team to Mars. He was never going to go out there and see them. The newspaper wouldn't have had information on the Giants' night games until two days later in the 60s, 70s and 80s. [i]Of course[/i] he cared less and then not at all.

(So by the time his kids were born, my father was more into hockey and boxing. He cared about the NFL, still, especially when the Bills went to 4 Super Bowls in the 1990s, but no, baseball lost him even though he took his sons to little league and taught us the rules. I still like baseball, a lot. I don't have kids; I have a nephew I hang around and he is into learning about basketball, soccer, hockey and baseball. I've never mentioned football to him. )

Anyway, I don't think the game in question against the Rams was fixed for the Rams to win it. I do think that the refs were obviously told to do whatever they could to extend the drama of the game. They were told this before that game, they've been told this after and you see it every week. At one point the official NFL Twitter account tweeted some self-aggrandizing bullshit about how OMG!! Look at all these games that ended just a touchdown apart!! Amazing, how exciting!! And, no, motherfuckers, it's you guys intentionally arranging this shit. So I do think that part was fixed, because otherwise the game was over. Apropos of nothing, I was really into wrestling as a kid and then one day I accepted the evidence that the outcomes were scripted.

(One part of this that gets lost is that the NFL made pass interference calls reviewable the next season. If you thought your dude got interfered with, well, throw a flag and they'll take a look. The refs [i]refused to overturn their original calls.[/i] Almost ENTIRELY. I don't have the stats. I only saw one overturned the entire year. [url=https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/saints/2019/11/25/sean-payton-nfl-pass-interference-replay-review-al-riveron/4300960002/]And it went against the Saints.[/url] What a giant "fuck you" from a group that is, collectively, incompetent subhuman garbage.)

I didn't watch the Super Bowl that year. I've never seen an entertainment product work so hard to turn fanatics off to itself. We went to a cat rescue the evening of that Super Bowl instead and adopted Clyde, who is a pretty damn good cat. I've gotten into the NHL again, deciding to really follow the local team my father followed. It's funny how quick your knowledge of players evaporates with football: the average career is 4 years. I simply do not know the great majority of the dudes running around any more. Maybe I'll get nostalgia for it someday, I get nostalgia for everything. When life isn't fair it's important to rage and fight and make it fair. But I guess what I am seeing is that when sports aren't fair, god, it's impossible to give a crap.


...

Hmm. I'm .... I'm seeing the Texans didn't manage to keep their game close against the Ravens tonight? OOPSIES /q /quit
/quit
:q!
/dontpost