So, what happens after you die?

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Tdarcos
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So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Tue May 12, 2020 4:46 pm

Ah, finally, a simple, non-controversial topic that everyone agrees on. We're all going to die someday. What's next? Is there anything next? This, of course, is one of those things that is a branch of metaphysics (how we examine reality). As such, this question, "So, what happens after you die?" cannot have a true answer.

Once you claim the answer to a metaphysical question is true, you crossed the line into religion. If someone actually provides a true answer, then the question stops being metaphysical.

So let's hear your opinion, if you dare. No cracks, people, someone is bound to have an answer you think is wrong, but that's their opinion. Someday one of three things will happen:
1. They discover they were right, in which case they'll be really pleased, unless they believed they were going to hell, in which case, they'll be really pissed.
2. They discover they were wrong, in which case they'll be really pissed, unless they believed they were going to hell (or believed they would cease to exist),, in which case, they'll be really pleased.
3. They cease to exist and will know nothing.

So we could divide this up into two questions:
1. Does your existence continue after death?
2. If so, what do you expect?

This isn't a philosophy class, you can "weasel" on your answers (I probably will) but this might be fun.

I'll give my own answers as a response, but I want to add a really great one from Star Trek Next Generation, given by Captain Picard to (what he thinks is) Data:

What is death?

Oh, is that all? Well, Data, you're asking probably the most difficult of all questions. Some see it as a changing to an indestructible form. Forever unchanging. They believe that the purpose of the entire universe is to then maintain that form in an Earth-like garden, which will give delight and pleasure through all eternity.
On the other hand, there are those who hold to the idea of our blinking into nothingness... (snaps fingers) with all of our hopes and dreams merely a delusion.

Which do you believe, sir?

Considering the marvelous complexity of the universe – its clockwork perfection, it's balances of this against that, matter, energy, gravitation, time, dimension – I believe our existence must be more than either of these philosophies. That what we are goes beyond Euclidean or other practical measuring systems and that our existence is part of a reality beyond what we understand now as reality.


Good luck to you.
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No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by AArdvark » Tue May 12, 2020 5:00 pm

Whey you die a particular thread gets locked and goes into Best Of


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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Tue May 12, 2020 5:08 pm

I think Aron Ra said something like, "Face it, you die, it's all over and that's it. It sucks, and nobody likes it."

And, given that we have no evidence that there is anything further, as a scientist I have to presume that's exactly it. The lights go out and you don't go home, you just turn into a few hundred pounds of rotting ape meat.

I did like Picard's comment as he adds a third choice, although, again, it's just the writer's opinion (or it might be Patrick Stewart's.)

Someone once said, "Where does a song go after it is finished playing? It doesn't."

We - as in our species - don't even know how our brains work, or even how consiousness exists. Is it something inherent, or is it an emergent property? And do these distinctions make any sense?

The only thing that used to bother me was the thought of nonexistence. But my sister pointed it out to me: You won't ever know you don't exist. You won't know anything.

Mark Twain reportedly said, "The universe existed for billions of years before I got here, and it didn't inconvenience me at all. I don't expect death will be any different."

So my answer is, that: I do not expect to survive after I die, but I wish I did.

But it doesn't matter, I'm on a roller coaster ride I did not choose to get on, have no control over where it's going, and no knowledge of it's destination, if it even has one. But I'll keep trying to have fun while I'm on the ride. Most of it has been.

And I'm grateful to had all of you along with me as passengers. Here's to many more years until the fare collector ends the ride.
(Yeah, I know there is no fare collector, it's a colorful metaphor.)
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No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey » Tue May 12, 2020 5:20 pm

Mankind, starting in 3000 begins a retro person project. The tech exists to reverse death and archivists start bringing us back. Get buried, kids.

Year 4000 it's the same thing but they travel through time and transfer consciousness of the to-be deceased to a modern body.
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by pinback » Tue May 12, 2020 5:27 pm

Tdarcos wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 4:46 pm
Ah, finally, a simple, non-controversial topic that everyone agrees on. We're all going to die someday.
I do not agree with this. The body dies, but there is no "you" inside it. Your assertion that there is, is a religious belief, which I'm surprised you're so readily willing to hold, given your distaste for religion.

The question is nonsensical to me. The same thing happens to you after you die that happened to you before you died: Nothing.
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey » Tue May 12, 2020 8:01 pm

pinback wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 5:27 pm
Tdarcos wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 4:46 pm
Ah, finally, a simple, non-controversial topic that everyone agrees on. We're all going to die someday.
I do not agree with this. The body dies, but there is no "you" inside it. Your assertion that there is, is a religious belief, which I'm surprised you're so readily willing to hold, given your distaste for religion.

The question is nonsensical to me. The same thing happens to you after you die that happened to you before you died: Nothing.
You gonna take that, Paul? On your home turf??
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Billy Mays » Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm

Ask your doctor for the cannabis prescription and then you won't have to worry about all of this depressing, gay shit. All it does is make you feel good and has zero negative side effects (or so I've heard). And since you are in a nursing home it will probably be edibles, which is candy. Have some fun for once in your life.

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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Flack » Wed May 13, 2020 7:38 am

Hey Paul, have you made a will yet? Will you put me down for your computer and NAS? I will go through them and collect any books you have on there and get them uploaded. Let me know where you would like the proceeds donated to (family or a charity, preferably not that hell hole you're stuck in). Also if you could get the staff there to wipe it down real good before mailing it, that would be great.
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Ice Cream Jonsey » Wed May 13, 2020 10:54 am

Billy Mays wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm
Ask your doctor for the cannabis prescription and then you won't have to worry about all of this depressing, gay shit. All it does is make you feel good and has zero negative side effects (or so I've heard). And since you are in a nursing home it will probably be edibles, which is candy. Have some fun for once in your life.
I am not sure if he's ever said though - any chance he is a lifelong teetotaler?
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Wed May 13, 2020 11:58 am

pinback wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 5:27 pm
Tdarcos wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 4:46 pm
Ah, finally, a simple, non-controversial topic that everyone agrees on. We're all going to die someday.
I do not agree with this. The body dies, but there is no "you" inside it. Your assertion that there is, is a religious belief, which I'm surprised you're so readily willing to hold, given your distaste for religion.
I think you're trying to say you don't believe consciousness even exists. Now, it was Joseph Campbell who asked the question, "Are we consciousness or are we the vehicle of consciousness?" In short, if I understand it, are we somewhere else thinking we're in this body (the vehicle of consciousness), or we actually are here (we are consciousess). I can accept either but I'm not going to accept neither; as Rene Descartes said, "I think, therefore I exist."

I have to presume I am consciousness because the evidence I have of my senses - however flawed they are - tells me this to be so.

It is not a religious belief. I'm not claiming there is a superior power. I am not claiming there is any existence beyond the one I do have. But I do know this: existence exists, and I am a part of it. To believe otherwise is to accept total nihilism, to reject reality and presume it has no meaning. And that I will not do.

Reality exists whether you believe it or not. Go step out into traffic and see how long reality will let you get away with ignoring it. Reality expects payment for disregarding its edicts in cold hard existence, whether or not you believe you possess that currency.
pinback wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 5:27 pm
The question is nonsensical to me. The same thing happens to you after you die that happened to you before you died: Nothing.
So please explain our capacity to communicate if there is nothing here. Please do. I'd like to hear an alternative explanation.

Because, as probably the greatest thinker alive (not me) wrote that those who claim there is no existence can't logically state any further theories, and can only shut up and die.
"I said, ooh, I'm blinded by the lights
No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by pinback » Wed May 13, 2020 12:17 pm

Tdarcos wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 11:58 am
I think you're trying to say you don't believe consciousness even exists.
I am saying the exact opposite of that. I am saying that that is all there is, with no separate entity to possess it.
It is not a religious belief.
Of course it is. There is an experience, and then thought creates and assumes the existence of a separate subject of that experience ("me"), which cannot (and will never) be found in either science or direct experience itself. It's a belief with exactly zero evidence to support it. But there's no arguing with a religious fanatic like yourself.
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by AArdvark » Wed May 13, 2020 5:44 pm

Here's a theory I read about. I sure don't remember where I saw it, was a long time ago. I don't actually believe it, but it was interesting. The spirit (or consciousness, whatever) is actually in some other dimension and it pokes through into our world as a physical body. Sort of like your hand pushing into a plastic sheet and it makes a hand shape in the plastic, that's living bodies as we see them. Again, I do not subscribe to this as it's pretty wacky, but its' interesting to think there's some other dimensions that are unknowable to us.

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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Billy Mays » Wed May 13, 2020 10:59 pm

Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 10:54 am
I am not sure if he's ever said though - any chance he is a lifelong teetotaler?
Anyone who gets a limb amputated because they refuse to stop guzzling skittles is not a teetotaler.

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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Wed May 13, 2020 11:22 pm

pinback wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 12:17 pm
Tdarcos wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 11:58 am
I think you're trying to say you don't believe consciousness even exists.
I am saying the exact opposite of that. I am saying that that is all there is, with no separate entity to possess it.
Ohhhhhhh. I Did misunderstand you. I think you're saying we;re something like The Great Link the founders were all part of in Star Trek:Deep Space Nine.

That's still, for all intents and purposes, the same as Joseph Campbell's "the vehicle of consciousness."
pinback wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 12:17 pm
It is not a religious belief.
Of course it is. There is an experience, and then thought creates and assumes the existence of a separate subject of that experience ("me"), which cannot (and will never) be found in either science or direct experience itself. It's a belief with exactly zero evidence to support it.
We can prove our existence to other people by interacting with them and manipulating the matter and energy of reality (the space-time contrinuum) to change its state.
pinback wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 12:17 pm
But there's no arguing with a religious fanatic like yourself.
I\m not a religious fanatic. I'm saying, that we do have evidence of the existence of something that, for the sake of argument appears to be consciousness through its effects on the universe. If your argument is that we do not actually have separate consciousness from others, I can buy that. There's still a big debate over whether we even have free will, or whether the question "do we have free will?" even make any sense.

I like what Christopher Hitchens said. "Do humans have free will? Of course. We have no choice."
"I said, ooh, I'm blinded by the lights
No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Wed May 13, 2020 11:28 pm

AArdvark wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 5:44 pm
Here's a theory I read about. The spirit (or consciousness, whatever) is actually in some other dimension and it pokes through into our world as a physical body.... Again, I do not subscribe to this
The late Joseph Campbell was absolutely one of the most brilliant thinkers I've ever seen. The interviews he did with Bill Moyers are amazing. What you are referring to is what Campbell referred to as "the vehicle of consciousness."

I think I'm going to see if I can find out if the public library has those videos or I can get one of Campbell's books on Kindle.
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No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Tdarcos » Wed May 13, 2020 11:32 pm

Billy Mays wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 10:59 pm
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 10:54 am
I am not sure if he's ever said though - any chance he is a lifelong teetotaler?
Anyone who gets a limb amputated because they refuse to stop guzzling skittles is not a teetotaler.
Billy, my leg was not amputated because of obesity or diabetes. I got an infection because I did not take care of my wound.

And I have never eaten Skittles. I eat Starburst. I would never stoop to eating non-GMO hard-shell non-chocolate candy.
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No, I can't sleep until I feel your touch."
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by RetroRomper » Wed May 13, 2020 11:45 pm

Tdarcos wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 11:32 pm
Billy, my leg was not amputated because of obesity or diabetes. I got an infection because I did not take care of my wound.
Ya...

Ya....

Ya........
This has been a...
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Billy Mays » Thu May 14, 2020 12:05 am

Tdarcos wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 11:32 pm
Billy, my leg was not amputated because of obesity or diabetes. I got an infection because I did not take care of my wound.
When a normal person gets wounded they either say "fuck, that's gonna need stitches" or "meh, that doesn't need stitches". That's the extent of it.
Tdarcos wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 11:32 pm
And I have never eaten Skittles. I eat Starburst. I would never stoop to eating non-GMO hard-shell non-chocolate candy.
Get the prescription from your doctor, it will make you feel better.

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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by RetroRomper » Thu May 14, 2020 12:13 am

Reaching out for help from any sort of health care entity in the US is never an easy thing.
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Re: So, what happens after you die?

Post by Jizaboz » Thu May 14, 2020 2:09 am

Had this conversation with Paul a few months ago. I am also a multi-dimensional being. I want to agree that my soul is either gonna get re-incarnated as a lower species or graduate out of this shit Elon Musk says is a hologram or others say is forced re-incarnation.

I feel a higher being(s) but it sure as shit isn’t what I’ve read in modern texts.

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